"The truth is, everything is a lie.  I don't look like I do in any of my [press] photos, and none of the reviews make sense..."

Gee, Paul, tell us how you really feel!  Twenty-eight-year old hip-hop artist MC Paul Barman's press often make him out to be a clown with a fro on his head and a dirty joke on his lips.  Actually, the Brown-educated Barman -- who actually has closely shorn curls -- is an accomplished artist and writer who is politely soft-spoken and who appears momentarily tongue-tied when a raunchy joke is, in fact, requested from him.

But those craving intelligent lyrics and impressive beats with a quirky and educated slant need look no farther than Barman's records.  Would legendary producer Prince Paul, known for his work with De La Soul, really be fooled?  Barman sent him his demo, and a partnership between the two Pauls was formed, with the result being the witty, short, and sweet 1998 E.P., It's Very Stimulating. With that album Barman was now on the map, and people listened up for more of his characteristic smooth flow that combines the "silly with the serious" by throwing together sex, pop culture, and societal issues in a way that leaves the listener chuckling -- and thinking.

After touring withDel the Funkee Homosapien, Blackalicious, and Dalek  -- and getting props from everyone from Rolling Stone to The Onion -- MC Paul Barman is back with a witty new record, Paullelujah!, and a tour with Whirlwind Heat that is packing the clubs from Paris to Philly.  StarPolish editorial staffer Alee Hoffman sat down with Barman for a rousing conversation before he took the stage at a sold-out TT The Bear's in Cambridge, Mass. Topics of the night spanned from creative freedom and eschewing music industry schmoozing to producing and the world's most romantic songs, until the two really got down to the nitty gritty...and started plans for their road trip to Nova Scotia. 

Crossing Over

STARPOLISH: I've noticed a lot of crossover type hip-hop picking up speed. I mean you always have A Tribe Called Quest, the Beastie Boys... and now there are also records by Northern State and The Streets that are big with all kinds of music fans. It seems these groups are getting previously non-hip-hop listeners into listening to more of that music. I wanted your opinion. (Barman's eyes have completely glazed over at this point) Dude, what?

BARMAN: I was listening!

STARPOLISH: You don't exactly have a mainstream sound; you kind of veer off into doing your own thing. How did you go about getting interest in your music when you are doing something that is so different? A lot of labels want to play it safe...

BARMAN: I just made a 7" and sent it to some of my heroes, and some of them replied.

STARPOLISH: Wow, that's a dream occurrence for many musicians.

BARMAN: I guess it's the dream. I never considered any industry bullshit, and I still don't.

STARPOLISH: With creative freedom being so important to you, how has it been as you gained success and more people got involved with your career...

BARMAN: Forget it! There's no compromise on that issue. There's compromise on every other damn issue!

STARPOLISH:So you get to stay true to you own thing, but still have a lot of success...

BARMAN: I have a lot of success?

STARPOLISH:I would say so! People know who you are, they buy your records, you are written about...

BARMAN: Okay.

STARPOLISH: You are headlining a tour here....

BARMAN: Headlining a tour, and it's especially [great playing with] The Whirlwind Heat.

STARPOLISH: I'm excited to see them, I never have.

BARMAN: They rule.

STARPOLISH:Your music has this crossover appeal, in that people who listen to hip-hop like what you are doing, and people who don't really listen to it, and maybe are more into alternative music, still get into your music. How do you blend your sounds so that it has that effect?

BARMAN: (Laughing) You must think I'm, like, some sort of A&R strategist!

STARPOLISH: (Laughing) Well, StarPolish is a career-based website, and the artists clicking in want to know these things... so a lot of my questions are like that.

BARMAN: I think that [the question] is just a fair description of my own experience growing up. You know, the kids who loved hip-hop and discovered it early, the ones who discovered it late, and the ones who were like "why the hell do you listen to that shit?" Well, actually, nobody said that.

School's Out

STARPOLISH:You're a Brown-educated person, and your E.P. was even called Post-Graduate Work.

BARMAN:  Yeah...I don't know if a 7" can qualify as an E.P....a lot of punk rock bands put 30 songs on a 7" and call it an album, I don't know if it's Kosher or not...I guess it was an E.P., and the one after that was the E.P., It's Very Stimulating...

STARPOLISH: Hey, speaking of It's Very Stimulating, your song "I'm Fricking Awesome" is on my workout mix tape. 

BARMAN: Ah, yes, I saw an email about that, young lady. And I must say, those work-outs have paid off...

STARPOLISH: (Laughs) Well, thank you, Paul, that's very nice of you. But anyway, what I wanted to say was that a lot of performers skip further education, they would rather go straight to their art, or they end up dropping out along the way.  But as someone who stayed with it, what sort of influences or experiences from college did you bring with you...and what helped you make the decision to make music your full-time work?

BARMAN: It was [during] my education that I went from primarily visual arts to primarily writing.  Sometimes, I myself wonder how my education helped me.  I went to school with a lot of brilliant people, and that's of course the biggest bonus.  Other than that, I don't think my education has sunk in yet.  I don't know if it was my particular education, because Brown had such a media analysis bent, but I find myself using [information I acquired there] absolutely all the time.  Particularly, in the current state of war.  For example, I saw a [news] headline yesterday that rhymed! It said "Osama BackedIraq for Terror Attack."   And it also called his soldiers "thugs."  Now, I thought to myself, "Why are Osama's well-trained soldiers thugs, and ours aren't?" Believe you me, they are called that elsewhere.  So, like, I don't know how illuminating that is, it seems very basic.  But I think that's how deep my education has sunk in right now; it's on a basic level.

STARPOLISH: What was your major?

BARMAN: I studied art throughout school. I studied a few other things, [like] The Politics of Anthology.  That wasn't exactly a class of my highest interest, but at the end of "Anarchist's Bookstore Part I," I talk about the African American Norton Anthology, which contains Public Enemy and Queen Latifah as two contributions. I would never, ever have referenced this Anthology unless I had the education.  So, I don't know.  In terms of music industry shit?  Not at all, just like the rest of these questions, I'm sorry to say.  You think I'm like a mover and a shaker; an industry maven? 

STARPOLISH: Well, I am not even concentrating on industry per se here.  It's more that you are doing your own thing...

BARMAN (reading slogan on interviewer's T-shirt) What do you know about the music industry, "Teenage Millionaire?!"

STARPOLISH: (Laughs) Hey, I'm doing a double major in journalism and music industry, I'll have you know.

BARMAN:  Do you have any brothers or sisters?

STARPOLISH: I have a brother, Gabe.

BARMAN: Older?

STARPOLISH: Older.  Brothers or sisters for you, Paul?

BARMAN: I have two brothers -- one older, one younger.

STARPOLISH: Are they into music?

BARMAN: Everybody is into music. 

STARPOLISH: My family is, too.  My father is a musician.

BARMAN: Oh, really? What does he play?

STARPOLISH: He plays the bass.

BARMAN: Awesome!

STARPOLISH: I don't know how involved I would have been with music if it hadn't been encouraged at home.  Coming from a musical home, do you think that was helpful in your decision to be a full-time musician?   It's a big risk...

BARMAN: I think making a risky decision like that is no big deal to borderline personalities.   You know I mean....(long pause)

STARPOLISH: Do you mean if that is where your heart is anywhere, you have to do it?

BARMAN: I guess what I am saying is, chase your dream, young lady!

STARPOLISH: (Laughing) That was very inspirational. Attempt the impossible!

BARMAN: Exactly!

Working with Prince Paul

STARPOLISH: I wanted to discuss the production of your album. You work with Prince Paul, who is legendary, and who I would guess an inspiration of yours.

BARMAN:  Of course.

STARPOLISH: What was that like for you?  How did you handle it?

BARMAN: It was pretty crazy, [but I did it] by being nervous and doing it anyway. 

STARPOLISH: So coming into it green, you must have learned a lot of things you might not have known went into the making of an album...

BARMAN: Oh, absolutely! I would say lyrically, I could come to many conclusions, [being] self-taught.  More experienced people, and people with more lyrical friends, you get to learn it together.  But outside of lyricisms, I was just working on instinct.  And that's very powerful, but there are also so many things to learn, in terms of technical aspects, and logistics. 

STARPOLISH: So with your second album, Paullelujah!  Compared to It's Very Stimulating, what sort of changes and new knowledge occurred?  With the new album, you were more established as an artist, more "in the game," if you will. 

Teacher Pet

BARMAN: With the second album, I had more of a hand in it.  There were just so many more people to talk to. I was a little bit more in charge, and it was more on me. 

STARPOLISH: Now that you've had your first tour, your first well-known album, and meeting all these people, what did you bring into the studio that you didn't think of before?

BARMAN:  Well, there was the genre experimentation that would be the most obvious answer.  I recorded a lot of [Paullelujah!] in San Francisco. 

STARPOLISH: Does location change things for you?

BARMAN: Yeah, location does change things.

STARPOLISH: Was there a more laid-back vibe there, as opposed to New York? 

BARMAN: Yeah, there was.

Serious & Silly

STARPOLISH: You have these lyrics that are really funny and silly at times.  But at the same time, your views of the world and its social ills are thrown in there, too.  In "School Anthem," I like that line where you talk about girls who take up knitting to pass the time in Advanced Placement classes. 

BARMAN: I did [know girls who did this].  They just sat in the back, and knitted things.      

STARPOLISH: It says something about American education, but it's really humorous too.  How do you combine serious with silly in such a smooth way?

BARMAN: Well, it depends.  If you've got the serious and the silly and all the words rhyme, it's a keeper.  And probably, the more those things are equal simultaneously, the more it's a keeper.

STARPOLISH: Do you sit down to write a song, it does it pop into your head?

BARMAN: Both. It just completely depends; there are so many different approaches.

STARPOLISH: Too vast to pinpoint?

BARMAN: Yeah!  All [of the ways] are valuable.  The serious versus silly dichotomy is vital. 

STARPOLISH: Tonight is the first time I will see you live, and I hear all this crazy stuff about your show.  It was written somewhere that it is a comparable to a circus...

BARMAN: It's not like that, really.  The truth is, everything is a lie.  I don't look like I do in any of my [press] photos, and none of the reviews make sense, and what people say is generally a little bit off.

STARPOLISH: What do you wish people would say or ask?

BARMAN:  I wish people would ask [me], "Do you want a ride to Nova Scotia?" 

STARPOLISH: (Laughing) OK -- do you want a ride to Nova Scotia (?

BARMAN: Yeah. You driving?

STARPOLISH: Why not? I'm not a very good driver, though.

BARMAN: (Turning to a friend of the interviewer) Have you guys driven together anywhere?

STARPOLISH'S FRIEND:(Laughing) Yes, and there are stories. It's scary...  

STARPOLISH: Do you have a car we could use?

BARMAN: Nope.

STARPOLISH: All I have is an old Volkswagen Rabbit! We could try, though.

BARMAN: So you're going to give me a ride to Nova Scotia...where are we gonna stay, baby?

STARPOLISH: I'm sure there are some nice hotels there, no?

BARMAN: (Laughs) There are. 

STARPOLISH: I'm in if we split the gas.

BARMAN: You got it!

STARPOLISH: All right, Spring Break 2003, man!  To get back to your live show, I hear you draw a portrait of an audience member while you rap one of your songs.

BARMAN: Yup, and I only have one piece of paper with me, it better work on the first try. [Ed. Note: Barman ended up drawing Julie, a friend of the interviewer, to "I'm Fricking Awesome" As Julie was dissatisfied with her portrait, Barman had her stay onstage and draw her own rendition of him.]

STARPOLISH: Where did you come up with the ideas for your live show?

BARMAN:  On a trampoline.

STARPOLISH: Ah. So was it while you were in the air or during the time you are on the trampoline getting ready for the next jump?

BARMAN: Either way.

STARPOLISH: I feel like in the air would be the most creative time.  So what's the craziest show you have had? 

BARMAN: Missoula, Montana kind of sticks out as pretty crazy.  There was a big marquee out front that said DJ  Paul Barman.  People were pretty wasted and rowdy in a pretty hilarious way.  There was a girl that kept rushing the stage to dance and show off her nipple piercing.  Then there was Detroit... Seattle was pretty crazy just because it was so damn early.  Seattle [all-ages] shows have a 9:30 curfew. There were three acts that night, so it started before dinner. Tonight is not all ages; you barely make it.

STARPOLISH: I know, but tomorrow is my birthday, so I will be that much older.

BARMAN: Congratulations. How does that feel?

STARPOLISH: Amazing!

BARMAN: (musing about name of the website): StarPolish... no one is ever going to polish this crusty old star! 

STARPOLISH: That's not true; you are already shining, Paul.  Anything new that you are bringing into this leg of the tour?

BARMAN: Uh, I guess we will find out tonight. It's the first show of the tour. I actually haven't performed in a while. 

STARPOLISH: What are you doing psych yourself up before the show? ...Oh, I guess talking to me.

BARMAN: And that's pretty psyching.

STARPOLISH: Whose live show do you really love?

BARMAN: I like the Reverend Horton Heat a lot.  I have seen them many times. I saw KRS-ONE's New Year's show a few years ago, that was awesome.

STARPOLISH: What other hip-hop shows do you like?

BARMAN: The X-Cutioners can get pretty damn crazy.  Oh, you know who is great?Live Humans! They put on an amazing show! It's DJ Quest, a drummer, and upright bass player.

STARPOLISH: Your music can pretty much tour alongside anything.  Whirlwind Heat is very different that what you do, but it works. So what's your stance on the kind of music you like to tour with?

BARMAN: I don't go by genre. It's more if  [the music] seems like it complements [each other] I'm touring with a band Christiansen soon.  I guess you could call them emo, but they would probably not like that.   I guess what is important with Whirlwind Heat is how much energy they bring. And also, they are so funny!  They work so hard... watching them work was like going to school on this tour.  They are really organized, and roll up in a certain way. 

STARPOLISH: What is the most romantic song you have ever heard? 

BARMAN: Sam Cooke "Live At The Harlem Club" is pretty hot.  You can hear some girls screaming in ecstasy [in the background].  It's pretty romantic.  Anything by Jonathon Richman is quite romantic.   "Tempted" by Squeeze too.

STARPOLISH: We could make a mix-tape.

BARMAN: And "I Only Have Eyes For You" by The Flamingos.  I mean, what are you gonna do with that?

STARPOLISH: You're gonna love it!

BARMAN: Yeah, that one probably wins. 

STARPOLISH: Tell me a joke!

(Barman complies, but as the interviewer is unsatisfied he goes for the gold with a dirty joke)

BARMAN: What do you call the link between a pierced nipple and a Prince Albert? A Dick Chain-y!

(This leaves the interviewer, who has affinity for sophomoric humor, in giggles)

STARPOLISH: So what is coming up?

BARMAN: I have the tour happening all spring, and gigs in Europe.  I'm also recording this year.  The new album will be more cohesive, I think.  It will tell more of a story from the beginning to the end of the album.